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Android: Netrunner» Forums » Rules

Subject: Workshop and Posted Bounty rss

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sechzger
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Hi,
my opponent scores a Posted bounty and forfeits it.
Can i then respond aand remove Counters from Workshop cards?
Or does he have priority again and can play Closed Accounts?

When is the last time i could remove counters?
 
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Ian Toltz
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I'm not positive, but I believe that in general the active player always had priority in case of people wanting to do things at the same time. There's no "responding" to things in this game, except for prevention effects.

So I believe you're SOL; you'd have to do this before your opponent scores the agenda.
 
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Andy Mills
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Both players have the opportunity to use paid abilities between Actions.

So in this example, the Corp scores Posted Bounty. The Runner has the opportunity to use paid abilities, like the one on PW, before the Corp can take an Action (Actions require clicks - playing Closed Accounts is an Action).
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Fiend Fellow
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manydills wrote:
Both players have the opportunity to use paid abilities between Actions.

So in this example, the Corp scores Posted Bounty. The Runner has the opportunity to use paid abilities, like the one on PW, before the Corp can take an Action (Actions require clicks - playing Closed Accounts is an Action).


Ahh but scoring Posted Bounty isn't an action, the only "action" that is taking a click with Posted Bounty is advancing it once. Rezzing it doesn't cost a click, and I believe that a runner can only use paid abilities after the use of a click. Posted Bounty -> Forfeit it -> Closed Account is all one click. Therefore, the runner can only use any paid abilities after Closed Accounts takes away all their credits.

This would a good use of Closed Accounts in Weyland, I hadn't actually thought of this combo. I'll have to make sure to include it in my next Weyland deck.
 
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Philip Goldfarb Styrt
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As I understand the timing windows, after each click there is a period for using paid abilities and scoring agendas, and within that period, priority alternates between the player whose turn it is and the player whose turn it is not. So scoring Posted Bounty and using its ability would go in the Corp's window of opportunity, but be followed by a Runner window of opportunity before the Corp can play a card or otherwise use a click. However, if the Corp had a paid ability that does not require clicks that was based on the runner having a tag, that could go before the Runner can respond.
 
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Ony Moose
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There is an opportunity to do paid-abilities/scoring/rezzing before and after each Action.

The corp can therefore score posted bounty and forfeit to add a tag. Now the corp can use another paid ability, or pass to the runner. The runner then gets a chance to use a paid ability, such as workshop. Then it is the corps turn to use paid abilities again, or pass and move onto the action stage and use an action to trash a resource, or use closed accounts.

The corp cannot however, use closed accounts after scoring posted bounty without giving a chance to the runner to use paid abilities.
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Teky Teky
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Kandiru wrote:
There is an opportunity to do paid-abilities/scoring/rezzing before and after each Action.

The corp can therefore score posted bounty and forfeit to add a tag. Now the corp can use another paid ability, or pass to the runner. The runner then gets a chance to use a paid ability, such as workshop. Then it is the corps turn to use paid abilities again, or pass and move onto the action stage and use an action to trash a resource, or use closed accounts.

The corp cannot however, use closed accounts after scoring posted bounty without giving a chance to the runner to use paid abilities.


What happens if the agenda is already advanced from, lets say, the previous turn, and this turn the corp only scores it... he's not using an "Action" since is not spending clicks, right? or beginning a turn is considered an action per se?

I'm getting really confused
 
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Ony Moose
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Scoring isn't an action, but its used in the paid-ability window in-between actions. Once the corp is done using paid abilities, the runner is allowed to use theirs BEFORE the corp can use their next action.
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Teky Teky
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Kandiru wrote:
Scoring isn't an action, but its used in the paid-ability window in-between actions. Once the corp is done using paid abilities, the runner is allowed to use theirs BEFORE the corp can use their next action.


So the corp Scores--> Forfeit--> Declare to has no further paid abilities, and then runner uses his paid ability?

So the corp uses ALL the paid abilities first and then the runner or they go one on each side?
 
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Adam Perry
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until they give the corp a paid ability to trash cards there's nothing you can do to avoid the runner unloading his workshop before you trash it.
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Andy Mills
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teky wrote:
Kandiru wrote:
Scoring isn't an action, but its used in the paid-ability window in-between actions. Once the corp is done using paid abilities, the runner is allowed to use theirs BEFORE the corp can use their next action.


So the corp Scores--> Forfeit--> Declare to has no further paid abilities, and then runner uses his paid ability?


This is correct, Teky.
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Andy Mills
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Fiendofthenorth wrote:
Ahh but scoring Posted Bounty isn't an action, the only "action" that is taking a click with Posted Bounty is advancing it once. Rezzing it doesn't cost a click, and I believe that a runner can only use paid abilities after the use of a click. Posted Bounty -> Forfeit it -> Closed Account is all one click.


No it isn't. Posted Bounty -> Forfeit isn't part of a click at all. It takes place in the paid ability window before the next click. The Runner gets to use paid abilities in that window, too.
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Teky Teky
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manydills wrote:
teky wrote:
Kandiru wrote:
Scoring isn't an action, but its used in the paid-ability window in-between actions. Once the corp is done using paid abilities, the runner is allowed to use theirs BEFORE the corp can use their next action.


So the corp Scores--> Forfeit--> Declare to has no further paid abilities, and then runner uses his paid ability?


This is correct, Teky.


This makes everything clear
 
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David Jensen
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Kandiru is correct.

There is an opportunity for the Runner to respond with paid abilities during any of the Corps scoring windows.

This window is typically the only time a Runner can pull off of Personal Workshop using credits. Since both closed accounts and trashing personal workshop will have no window of availability to remove it.

Corps: Scores and Forfeits Posted Bounty in the same window.
Runner: Declares paid abilities. (Namely pulling off PW).
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Fiend Fellow
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manydills wrote:
Fiendofthenorth wrote:
Ahh but scoring Posted Bounty isn't an action, the only "action" that is taking a click with Posted Bounty is advancing it once. Rezzing it doesn't cost a click, and I believe that a runner can only use paid abilities after the use of a click. Posted Bounty -> Forfeit it -> Closed Account is all one click.


No it isn't. Posted Bounty -> Forfeit isn't part of a click at all. It takes place in the paid ability window before the next click. The Runner gets to use paid abilities in that window, too.


Too true, I didn't realize that scoring is in the paid ability window. The runner will be too late to stop Closed Accounts when the corp plays it, but he will have time to clear Personal Workshop if he so chooses (which he probably would after seeing Weyland throw away an Agenda to land a tag).
 
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Tunguska's CPA
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So if I score and forfeit Posted Bounty, ask the runner "Yo, you want to use any paid abilties?", the runner says "nah, bro. I'm good" and then I click and play Closed Accounts - the runner has no recourse?

If I am correct, this is because you would resolve 2.1 (paid abilities, rez non-ICE, score agendas), then 2.2 (action) before going to "after each action".

In a situation like Neural EMP or PSF, "after each action" is in response to 2.2 (Corp did damage, runner prevents with paid ability). But using Personal Workshop isn't in response to the resource being trashed, right?

I'm not sure if I'm saying this right but stuff like plascrete carapace, net shield, etc are paid abilities useable when certain events happen/conditions occur. But trashing personal workshop, or playing closed accounts would be resolved before the Runner's paid abilities could be used. If you get tagged and don't immediately pay off personal workshop, your only recourse would be a card that was "trash: prevent a resource from being trashed".

Or am I (as usual) completely batty?
 
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Brian Moore
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cervantes3773 wrote:
So if I score and forfeit Posted Bounty, ask the runner "Yo, you want to use any paid abilties?", the runner says "nah, bro. I'm good" and then I click and play Closed Accounts - the runner has no recourse?

If I am correct, this is because you would resolve 2.1 (paid abilities, rez non-ICE, score agendas), then 2.2 (action) before going to "after each action".

In a situation like Neural EMP or PSF, "after each action" is in response to 2.2 (Corp did damage, runner prevents with paid ability). But using Personal Workshop isn't in response to the resource being trashed, right?

I'm not sure if I'm saying this right but stuff like plascrete carapace, net shield, etc are paid abilities useable when certain events happen/conditions occur. But trashing personal workshop, or playing closed accounts would be resolved before the Runner's paid abilities could be used. If you get tagged and don't immediately pay off personal workshop, your only recourse would be a card that was "trash: prevent a resource from being trashed".

Or am I (as usual) completely batty?


You are correct. If the effect that applies a tag resolves, you ask the runner if they want to use any paid abilities, and they say no...there's absolutely nothing (currently) in the game that prevents a resource from being trashed. The runner's opportunity to pay to remove cards from personal workshop is over. It's too late. They can play all the paid abilities they want, after personal workshop is trashed, but it won't be paying credits to remove counters from cards on the personal workshop that is now destroyed.
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Tunguska's CPA
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Niil945 wrote:
[...]
You are correct. If the effect that applies a tag resolves, you ask the runner if they want to use any paid abilities, and they say no...there's absolutely nothing (currently) in the game that prevents a resource from being trashed. The runner's opportunity to pay to remove cards from personal workshop is over. It's too late. They can play all the paid abilities they want, after personal workshop is trashed, but it won't be paying credits to remove counters from cards on the personal workshop that is now destroyed.


Thanks! I'm usually a little loose with my rules (most games can tolerate a bit of fudging), but I've been trying to tighten up with Netrunner these days. I don't want to the lonely boy in the corner at regionals who doesn't know the rules well.
 
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Ony Moose
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Netrunner doesn't have anything you can do "in response" which happens before the thing you were responding to like magic does. In netrunner the player who's turn it is can play as many non-click abilities as they want, then the other play can play some afterwards if they want to. Then if any were used, the player who's turn it is has another chance to use paid abilities, etc.

The only exceptions are Prevent/Avoid effects which simply negate something from happening and can be used (and only used) when the thing they prevent is about to happen.

 
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Scott C
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cervantes3773 wrote:
In a situation like Neural EMP or PSF, "after each action" is in response to 2.2 (Corp did damage, runner prevents with paid ability). But using Personal Workshop isn't in response to the resource being trashed, right?

As has been mentioned, there's no "in response." The reason you're getting hung up here on Plascrete and Net Shield (and Deus X, for that matter), is because they're "prevent" abilities -- the one exception to the normal paid ability timing.

Personal Workshop doesn't have any prevent abilities.
 
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