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Mr. Jack Pocket: Goodies» Forums » Rules

Subject: What is the opening placement of the new tile? rss

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Gregg Olheiser
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The goodies only comes with the Alibi Card and Tile, where do you place him to open play, surely this must impact the game? (I understand the Alibi card replacement, that is easy enough when adjusting the advantage between Sherlock and Jack)

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Perry Tatman
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whachacha wrote:
The goodies only comes with the Alibi Card and Tile, where do you place him to open play, surely this must impact the game? (I understand the Alibi card replacement, that is easy enough when adjusting the advantage between Sherlock and Jack)


I think that the new alibi and tile card replace one of the existing alibi and tile cards. Not added to the total mix.
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Scrumpy Jack
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we add it to the existing 9, shuffle all 10, and remove one randomly.
 
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Lee Valentine
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But what is the rule for the placement of the new tile?

Lee
 
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Russ Williams
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hudarklord wrote:
But what is the rule for the placement of the new tile?

Lee

The game's description says, "James Maybrick can replace any other character in the game, which is played with the same rules as before."

So set up as the base game rules say to set up: "shuffle the cards and set them out in a square with the suspect side face up".
 
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Lee Valentine
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This doesn't seem to be how the tile is played. Other tiles in front of detectives are turned back wall out toward them. There's only one orientation where that's possible for normal tiles in front of detectives at the start of the game.

There is no one back wall on this tile (it's streets are L-shaped, not T-shaped). On the iOS version the street on this tile always faces the board edge, or seems to at least, although not always in the same rotation.

Lee
 
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Russ Williams
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The rules explicitly say "Position and orientation of the tiles is chosen randomly."

This seems pretty clear. I don't see what the confusion is.
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Lee Valentine
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russ wrote:
The rules explicitly say "Position and orientation of the tiles is chosen randomly."

This seems pretty clear. I don't see what the confusion is.


The confusion is that with every other starting tile in the game, they are rotated away from the detective they are in front of. If there is a rules sheet that comes with the expansion, maybe it explains this. I just have it on iOS with no expansion rules. I was wondering why it is not being turned away from the detectives like every other tile in the game would be (for starting tiles in front of detectives).

Point of fact, the position of the starting tiles is normally chosen randomly, but the orientation of three starting tiles is 100% non-random. The detectives start in the same locations, and for each normal tile starting in front of them there is exactly one orientation that it can be placed in. That's non-random orientation.

If this tile is 100% random even when it is in front of a detective, then it doesn't function like the other tiles in the game. That may explain some of the behavior that I'm seeing in the iOS game with this tile.

Lee
 
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Russ Williams
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Yes, the rules do indeed say "Rotate each of these three areas so that the Detective tokens are next to a wall." OK, so do that. If the area has more than one wall, shrug, whatever: Rotate it so that one of its walls is next to its Detective token.

It really doesn't need to be any more complicated than that.

If you're worried about somehow getting an unfair/imbalanced/whatever setup, then you and your opponent can each say which wall you want to touch the detective. If you agree, then use that wall. If you disagree, then pick it randomly.
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Lee Valentine
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russ wrote:
Yes, the rules do indeed say "Rotate each of these three areas so that the Detective tokens are next to a wall." OK, so do that. If the area has more than one wall, shrug, whatever: Rotate it so that one of its walls is next to its Detective token.

It really doesn't need to be any more complicated than that.

If you're worried about somehow getting an unfair/imbalanced/whatever setup, then you and your opponent can each say which wall you want to touch the detective. If you agree, then use that wall. If you disagree, then pick it randomly.



Um, I'm trying to play on the iOS. I am assuming it is using "official" rules for this tile. It is not rotating the tile by default away from the detectives. It may be placing the tile randomly. It's tough to say. Since I don't own the print expansion, I am trying to determine what the official rules are for the placement of this tile. That's why I posted to this thread and echoed the question at the top of the thread about the official rules for the use of this tile.

It is not a question about asking for variants that you or I could use for fun play. I'm asking how this is handled by the official rules, so that I can better understand how the iOS game is working. The iOS game doesn't come with a rules list for this tile.

Lee
 
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Russ Williams
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hudarklord wrote:
russ wrote:
Yes, the rules do indeed say "Rotate each of these three areas so that the Detective tokens are next to a wall." OK, so do that. If the area has more than one wall, shrug, whatever: Rotate it so that one of its walls is next to its Detective token.

It really doesn't need to be any more complicated than that.

If you're worried about somehow getting an unfair/imbalanced/whatever setup, then you and your opponent can each say which wall you want to touch the detective. If you agree, then use that wall. If you disagree, then pick it randomly.



Um, I'm trying to play on the iOS. I am assuming it is using "official" rules for this tile.

A risky assumption for a computer game based on a board game, alas, as I have seen that many such programs have rule bugs. :/

Quote:
It is not rotating the tile by default away from the detectives. It may be placing the tile randomly. It's tough to say. Since I don't own the print expansion, I am trying to determine what the official rules are for the placement of this tile. That's why I posted to this thread and echoed the question at the top of the thread about the official rules for the use of this tile.

It is not a question about asking for variants that you or I could use for fun play. I'm asking how this is handled by the official rules, so that I can better understand how the iOS game is working. The iOS game doesn't come with a rules list for this tile.

Well, I'm trying to tell you what I sincerely believe are the official rules, not a variant!

The expansion itself has no additional rules supplied with it, as far as I know: it's just a tile and a card. (At least if mine ever had rules, I don't remember them at all, and they've gone AWOL... and note that in none of the rule question threads does anyone ever mention or quote printed rules... and this photo of the expansion contents shows no rules...)

For me, the obvious principle for any game+expansion is "If an expansion doesn't explicitly change a base game rule, then the base game rule continues to apply."

Since the expansion does not explicitly change the setup rules, I take the base game setup rules as officially applicable with the expansion, and we are not intended to suppose that there are some unspoken additional rules, or they would have included them. So: Randomly place the tiles you're using in the game, and turn the 3 which are next to detectives so that there are walls next to the detective.

It seems obvious that the intent is simply to start with an arbitrary/random 3x3 array of tiles, with walls adjacent to the 3 detectives, and I don't see why the expansion tile would need to change that.

But of course I am not officially linked to the product and am only telling how I see it; if that is not sufficiently convincing reasoning, I understand. In that case, I guess you'll need to write directly to the author or publisher to try to get a more official answer, as they seem to not be replying to this forum thread.
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Ad Astra Per Aspera
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All this for a 10th tile that is truly no different than the other 9 included with the game? If you want it to be a problem, then a problem it will be. Or, you could be like anyone else that has the expansion and just use it the same as the other 9.

If you're talking about the app, then it's moot. The app does whatever it wants and you play along. It literally decided on the rules for you.
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