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Space Hulk (second edition)» Forums » General

Subject: Not quite difficult for the marines? rss

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Franjo
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Hi,

Maybe they had got too much luck, but in our last three or four sessions the terminator marines defeated the aliens without suffering a lot. If the marine player plays smart, not taking unnecesary risks, I found that he has quite a lot chances to win the game, specially if the flamethrower guy gets his lighter working as intended: flaming groups of genestealers and placing fire walls when needed.

What is your experience? I'm playing (of course) 2nd edition rules.
 
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Toco
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3rd Edition aliens win 99%.
 
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Ian McCarthy
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I recommend playing 1st edition rules with either 2nd or 3rd edition components.
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Mark Evans
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perdut wrote:
Hi,

Maybe they had got too much luck, but in our last three or four sessions the terminator marines defeated the aliens without suffering a lot. If the marine player plays smart, not taking unnecesary risks, I found that he has quite a lot chances to win the game, specially if the flamethrower guy gets his lighter working as intended: flaming groups of genestealers and placing fire walls when needed.

What is your experience? I'm playing (of course) 2nd edition rules.


This hasn't been my experience I find the second edition rules and scenarios to be mostly balanced and challenging for both sides.
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Franjo
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Maybe it have been just a run of bad luck for the genestealers. In two of the games they had got a pair of 0 blip counters when the marines were getting closer to the objective.

Anyway, if the marine knows how and when to use the flamethrower, it's quite bloody for the genestealers try to play aggressively.
 
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Mark Evans
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The flamers can be cumbersome and hard to employ against a cagey Genestealer.
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Franjo
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KenToad wrote:
I recommend playing 1st edition rules with either 2nd or 3rd edition components.


Heavy flamethrowers in 1st edition have different rules, IIRC, haven't them?

In 2nd edition, a good flame chain + one more flame at the last burning square can be devastating.
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David Damerell
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drmark64 wrote:
The flamers can be cumbersome and hard to employ against a cagey Genestealer.


Quite. It would be nice to cook 10 Stealers with a full load and average dice, but that does demand quite a lot of cooperation from the opponent.

In a sense I think the 2e flamer is stronger than the 1e flamer because it's weaker. You can never cook a room full with 1/6 of the ammo, so you won't be tempted to try it; instead you'll use it as a blocking device, and you can both ensure a 35/36 chance of a kill on the critical Stealer, and block a side corridor and run past it.
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Franjo
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damerell wrote:
you'll use it as a blocking device, and you can both ensure a 35/36 chance of a kill on the critical Stealer, and block a side corridor and run past it.


This
 
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David Damerell
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perdut wrote:
damerell wrote:
you'll use it as a blocking device, and you can both ensure a 35/36 chance of a kill on the critical Stealer, and block a side corridor and run past it.

This


The downside is that you simply cannot do mass execution with it.

Another "strength from weakness" aspect, I think, is the way you can't use command points on the Stealer turn. This compels the marines to spend them on their own turn, keeping them moving - and ultimately that must be their goal.
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Franjo
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You can mass execution in 2ed as long as you can flame adjacent and on line of sight and fire squares, with or without stealers inside them.

I cannot comment the second aspect, because I never played using CPs on the stealers turn, but your thought seems quite plausible.
 
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David Damerell
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perdut wrote:
You can mass execution in 2ed as long as you can flame adjacent and on line of sight and fire squares, with or without stealers inside them.


You're missing the point. In 1st, you can potentially catch 13 stealers (or even more in a Deathwing corridor tile) with just one-sixth of the flamer's ammunition. Because the flamer uses a fixed quantity of ammo every time it is fired, there is no direct downside to shots that cover a large number of victims. In 2nd, you simply cannot kill as many Stealers with the available ammo, and any time you fire more than the 2 flame counters needed for a block, you are using extra ammo you may want later.
 
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Franjo
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Well, as I said before, I didn't know how exactly the flamer works in 1st ed., so thanks for lighting it up
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Peter Williams
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damerell wrote:
perdut wrote:
You can mass execution in 2ed as long as you can flame adjacent and on line of sight and fire squares, with or without stealers inside them.


You're missing the point. In 1st, you can potentially catch 13 stealers (or even more in a Deathwing corridor tile)
I don't get how you can do this.
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David Damerell
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WhoDat wrote:
damerell wrote:
You're missing the point. In 1st, you can potentially catch 13 stealers (or even more in a Deathwing corridor tile)

I don't get how you can do this.


A 3x3 room with 4 exits can contain 13 Stealers. In 1st Edition, a flame shot attacks every Stealer on the tile.

(Of course, as mentioned above, this is a false hope, because the Stealer player is unlikely to be a complete idiot and pack them in nicely for you.)
 
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