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Subject: Taking Clues if Monsters are present rss

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Helen Holzgrafe
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So, you've evaded the monster at a location. There's also a Clue Token there. Do you actually get to pick it up or do you have to defeat the monster that is guarding it first?

-Helen
 
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Ilja Preuß
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In my understanding, you can even pick it up *before* starting the fight.
 
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Luca Iennaco
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I haven't played in a while (and surely this game needed a better rulebook) but if I remember well you pick the Clue BEFORE facing (or evading) the Monster (so you could use it to fight/evade, if you really wish).
 
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JGT
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hholzgrafe wrote:
So, you've evaded the monster at a location. There's also a Clue Token there. Do you actually get to pick it up or do you have to defeat the monster that is guarding it first?


Monsters and Clues are completely separate gameplay entities. By that, I mean there isn't any way they can affect each other on the board. If you have evaded the Monster, feel free to keep running and grab the Clue.
 
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Magic Pink
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Just remember you have to END your move on the space with the monster to actually grab the clue. So, to get the clue without fighting, you'll have to evade it twice, once when you land and once when you try to leave.
 
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Philip Thomas
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Magic Pink, you only fight when you try to leave and when you end your turn there. Since you have to end your turn there when you pick up a clue, yes you will have to fight the monster next turn if it is still there, but it could be removed before then (by another investigator, or the mythos card).
 
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Magic Pink
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Philip Thomas wrote:
Magic Pink, you only fight when you try to leave and when you end your turn there. Since you have to end your turn there when you pick up a clue, yes you will have to fight the monster next turn if it is still there, but it could be removed before then (by another investigator, or the mythos card).


Where exactly are we disagreeing?
 
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Steve McIlhatton
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Magic Pink wrote:
Philip Thomas wrote:
Magic Pink, you only fight when you try to leave and when you end your turn there. Since you have to end your turn there when you pick up a clue, yes you will have to fight the monster next turn if it is still there, but it could be removed before then (by another investigator, or the mythos card).


Where exactly are we disagreeing?


You said you'd have to evade twice but you only evade the once.. when you move away from the location (assuming the monster is still there).

When you finish your move in the space to pick up the clue there is no combat.
 
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Ilja Preuß
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Innocent Bystander wrote:

When you finish your move in the space to pick up the clue there is no combat.


Where are you getting *that* from? Even Philip said that you have to fight a monster "when you end your turn there".
 
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Eddie the Cranky Gamer
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You have to fight or evade a monster when you
- End your movement in the same space as it
- Try to leave a space with a monster.

To get your clue token you need to end your movement in its space, so combat or evasion would need to happen then. What is a bit unclear is if there is any ordering to when combat needs to happen. Both the combat/evasion and clue getting happen at the end of movement. Which goes first? I've never heard an answer.

We have played that combat goes first though. You can't scrounge about for clues without confronting the evil at the location. Seemed the best call at the time, but we've not played in some time and this may have been officially errata'd since.




If, on your NEXT turn, the monster is still there. You will need to evade/combat it to leave or to stay. If both the monster and the player hang out at the location for some time evasion/combat would happen every round.
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Martin Lindström
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apotheos wrote:

We have played that combat goes first though. You can't scrounge about for clues without confronting the evil at the location. Seemed the best call at the time, but we've not played in some time and this may have been officially errata'd since.


That depends on how you define what a clue is.

A clue could be anything from a secret hidden document to huge graffitti on a house wall, in which case the investigator could use his newfound-knowledge in the combat.

I do however see the benefits of doing it your way.
 
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Keith M. Sandler
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My interpretation would be as follows:

Since clues can only be picked up if an investigator ends his movement phase in the location with the clue, and since evasion/combat begins when a character tries to end his movement in or move out of a space containing a monster, the combat/evasion needs to occur first. The combat could, for example, cause the character to go insane or unconscious and move immediately to the asylum or hospital.

Does that sound right to anyone? This would be a nice one to be in the next version of the FAQ.

--kMs
 
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Eddie the Cranky Gamer
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That is pretty sensible. To successfully "End your Movement" you need to fight the monster - with all risks that presents.

An excellent way to put it!
 
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Kevin Bender
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Dark Son wrote:
My interpretation would be as follows:

Since clues can only be picked up if an investigator ends his movement phase in the location with the clue, and since evasion/combat begins when a character tries to end his movement in or move out of a space containing a monster, the combat/evasion needs to occur first. The combat could, for example, cause the character to go insane or unconscious and move immediately to the asylum or hospital.

Does that sound right to anyone? This would be a nice one to be in the next version of the FAQ.

--kMs


I agree that we need an official ruling for this situation.

However, "End of Movement" triggers both the need to evade or fight a monster and triggers the ability for the investigator to pick up clues at a location. The clue token should be recovered before combat occurs regardless of the outcome of the combat/evade.

(Page 6 of the rulebook reads "Likewise, if an investigator ends his movement...he must fight or evade each monster." and on page 8 it reads "Anytime an investigator ends his movement in a location that contains clue tokens, he may immediately take any or all of those clue tokens")

This is how we've been playing, but I understand why some might infer the need to wait for combat to resolve to see if the investigator is still in the same location as the clue.

Remember that these are not small areas, and the creature could be discovered in the process of searching for clues. Therefore the investigator can discover something interesting at the location before that zombie comes shambling out of a darkened alley.
 
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Sven
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I would play it that way, that you first pick up the clue and then deal with the monster.

But actually...does this ever happen? When do you have a monster and a clue token in the same space?
Clue tokens can only be found in locations, not in the streets. Monsters appear in locations, if a gate opens there. The opening gate automatically removes all clue tokens. Monsters always move out of locations and never back in.
So I only see two occasions, when such a thing could happen (and we never encountered this as far as I remember):
1) A gate opens in a location and a monster spawns. An investigator sneaks past the monster, goes through the otherworld, sneaks past the monster again, closes the gate and sneaks past the monster a third time to leave the location. Then a clue appears in the location. All this assumes, that the monster doesn´t move.
2) A Hound of Tindalos moves into a location with an investigator. The investigator sneaks away and later a clue appears there. Again, the Hounds of Tindalos don´t move.

Are there more possible occasions, that I overlooked? And, more interesting, are they more propable than the ones I mentioned above?
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Michael Gibbs
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Tanakor wrote:
I would play it that way, that you first pick up the clue and then deal with the monster.

But actually...does this ever happen? When do you have a monster and a clue token in the same space?
Clue tokens can only be found in locations, not in the streets.

Are there more possible occasions, that I overlooked? And, more interesting, are they more propable than the ones I mentioned above?


Not true. I know of at least one Mythos card that will place a clue on the Miskitanic U. street site. It is the one that has the monsters onthe card, and you have to defeat them all before they get to 8 on the card.
 
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Sven
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You are refering to the rumor-card "The terrible Experiment".
No rumor ever places clues. You obviously are confusing this with the entry "Activity at: Miskatonic U.-Street", which just means that an activity-marker is placed in the M.U.-Street to mark where the rumor-card is taking place.
 
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