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Subject: Carrying and using items??? rss

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Kevin Chamberlain
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Please, I need final clarification on this. Can a character carry AND use an item of any color?

So, a blue character(a warrior for example) pick up a blue sword and use it? Also, he can pick up a yellow sword and use it?

I have been playing that you can only pick up and use an item that is of a different color. I figure this only makes sense. Why would you put good items like potions, sword, armour, etc away from you? You would always place those in the first dungeon square near your starting line at the beginning of setup. It would make no sense to not guarantee yourself those good items when playing down your item tokens.

I know I can play by my own rules but I'm fussy when it comes to game rules. I like starting off playing by the official rules and then after only many plays maybe changing something for the better. And I hope the rule is for only different color items because that would make the most sense.
 
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Jim Brooks
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Your characters can pick up & use items of any color.

From page 9 of the English rules:

"Blue characters can use and carry Yellow objects and
vice versa."
 
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Eric Franklin
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Shug wrote:
Right, "can use".... not "can ONLY use"...

Earlier in the book, the rules say (forgive the paraphrase, this is from memory): "A character can only carry one object or wounded character of his own color."

Ambiguous wording. Definitive clarification please, rules people: Can a blue character use both yellow and blue items? Or can they only use yellow items?


The vague or unclear wording here is my fault - I hadn't realized that the wording here would be such a problem. Amend the sentence about "one object or wounded character" to read:
Quote:
Each character can only carry one object of any color or one wounded character of his own color

Blue characters may carry and use blue or yellow or red or green objects. Any character can carry any object, but only wizards can USE the fireball wand. Blue wizards can use yellow (or green or red) fireball wands, and vice versa.

See also this thread: http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/97985

Eric
 
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Jim Brooks
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Shug wrote:
Right, "can use".... not "can ONLY use"...

Earlier in the book, the rules say (forgive the paraphrase, this is from memory): "A character can only carry one object or wounded character of his own color."

Ambiguous wording. Definitive clarification please, rules people: Can a blue character use both yellow and blue items? Or can they only use yellow items?


"of his own color" only refers to the wounded character. You can't pick up the other player's wounded characters. You can pick up and use any colored items. I agree with you that the rule probably should have been worded differently to avoid confusion. I was confused by this the first time that I read it also.
 
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Kevin Chamberlain
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Well I think being able to carry and use your own color token ruins the whole game. I have to rate this game lower now.
 
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Eric Franklin
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jim.brooks10 wrote:
Shug wrote:
Right, "can use".... not "can ONLY use"...

Earlier in the book, the rules say (forgive the paraphrase, this is from memory): "A character can only carry one object or wounded character of his own color."

Ambiguous wording. Definitive clarification please, rules people: Can a blue character use both yellow and blue items? Or can they only use yellow items?


"of his own color" only refers to the wounded character. You can't pick up the other player's wounded characters. You can pick up and use any colored items. I agree with you that the rule probably should have been worded differently to avoid confusion. I was confused by this the first time that I read it also.


Any ambiguous wording in the Base Set and Paladins and Dragons is my fault.

I am glad, however, that the question of other colored items seems to be the only consistently confusing rule exclusive to the English version of the base game - the other confusing elements seem to cause questions in both the French AND the English versions.

Eric
 
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David Tolin
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BooChihuahua wrote:
Well I think being able to carry and use your own color token ruins the whole game. I have to rate this game lower now.


Just curious--what is it that bothers you so much about this? You don't get to place your own items when a room is revealed, so you're not guaranteed to get hold of your best items right away--even if you put them in the first room next to your starting line.

How does it ruin the game?
 
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Andy Allardyce
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And also on the concept of "ruining the game" - if you strongly prefer your own modified rules - what's wrong with continuing to enjoy the game "your way"?
 
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Jens Pankoke
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After some games of DT I considere that most of the times it is really difficult to get one's own items.

Because the number of item per table is restricted, one cannot avoid to place items near the opponent's starting line (at least, I could not avoid it, anyone can?). Especially, if you don't work out a strategy of placing BEFORE placing the first Character/ Item, then you end up with your fireball still to place and the only possibility left is near the opponent's starting line. Ok, that happens maybe only one time, but if it's not the fireball, it's the armour or something else.

Also, if you put too much items near your starting line, in the beginning phase of the game you are slow because you can't flip the more distant tables easily. If on the contrary you put a character near the starting line, you can flip this tile, place your character near the next tile, and then flip the next tile, too.

And then there is always your opponent, who hides your tiles, and sure he will hide them well or place them next to one of his characters.

Maybe it's best, once placed, to forget about the colour of the items. They are just there. Imagine that the bad magicien has ripped them off the characters and hidden them in the dungeon. As a character, you will be happy to find ANY item and take it instantely, just in order to survive .

Best regards, trumpetfish
 
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Olivier Lamontagne
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You can use items of any colors, so it is possible to use 2 fireballs in the same game. Really devastating!
 
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S J
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BooChihuahua wrote:
Well I think being able to carry and use your own color token ruins the whole game. I have to rate this game lower now.


Everyone is entitled to thier opinion on this, so as someone else said, play it the way you like best. I would like to point out my opinion of why it is better to be able to use items of both colors though.

1. It makes the initial item placement a more critical phase. You know when you place an item in a room, that the opponent will get to decide where in the room it will start at. Thus you have to be very careful with your placement so you don't end up bascially handing your items over to them. Likewise it adds strategy in placement of your hidden characters to position them in the best possible way to "steal" your opponent's items right off the bat.

2. It creates some races for the items. If the items were pre-locked to a side by color, there would not be any strategy dedicated to getting the items first.

Overall, I think that making the items free-for-all like they are in the base rules adds depth to that game that would not be there if they were locked by color.
 
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John McGeehan
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The fact that items are not locked by color creates some delicious questions when you're placing your tokens, though.

If you could only use your items (or only use your opponent's items) you could simply place the items in such a way that it's either easy for you to get them, or hard for your opponent. As it is, you must be careful - there's only so many spots for tokens, and placing your item tokens too close to your opponents means they could get them before you - however, if you decide "OK, I'll place them near myself!" then you end up placing your characters closer to your opponents, and remember, when a room is flipped over, the "flipper" places all tokens except their own color items (even enemy characters!) - which could mean your opponent could place your characters in very vulnerable positions.

It's one of those agonizing decisions that makes DT so interesting.

T.
 
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Olivier Lamontagne
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It also balances the game with the extensions, eventually, you will have to choose carefully the items for your team...it is better to take average objects than six powerful items, and taking the risk that the opponent gets it.

The Pickpocket also changes the balance, stealing the wizard's staff for exemple.

In Powers of Darkness, there are cursed item with a special rule for placement.

Items are quite important in DT, limiting them to color-owner removes much, and makes the pickpocket pointless.
 
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