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Subject: Facing and sharp turns. rss

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Stuart Platt
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If you can change facing at the beginning of each of your Move actions, and 'Route Adjustment' ignores facing, then what is the point of restricting sharp turns? When would this even be an issue?

The example in the rules which talks about sharp turns restricting movement also seems to ignore the free facing at the start of each move action.

No sarcasm / complaining in the above - simply wondering what I am missing.
 
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Peter Schott
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Because I might want to get to a place within my move that would require a sharp turn. I've had that come up a couple of times where I could have picked up or dropped off of only I could have doubled back just a bit with a sharp turn. Perhaps someone else took the goods you wanted so you have to make new plans and things are off from your original plan.

The free facing let's you change your starting direction but that's completely different than making a sharp turn while moving - something with which an airship would likely have trouble. Route adjustments are there to help the player out, especially if your plans just got thrown off so it's more the idea that you scrapped all other plans to get your airship into a better position. I think it works relatively well thematically, though I usually just accept it as the rules of the game.
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Mathue Faulkner
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paschott wrote:
Because I might want to get to a place within my move that would require a sharp turn. I've had that come up a couple of times where I could have picked up or dropped off of only I could have doubled back just a bit with a sharp turn. Perhaps someone else took the goods you wanted so you have to make new plans and things are off from your original plan.

The free facing let's you change your starting direction but that's completely different than making a sharp turn while moving - something with which an airship would likely have trouble. Route adjustments are there to help the player out, especially if your plans just got thrown off so it's more the idea that you scrapped all other plans to get your airship into a better position. I think it works relatively well thematically, though I usually just accept it as the rules of the game.

What he said.

It comes up when you are planning and only have certain distance cards available (usually because you're planning to use them on prior movements). More often, however, it comes up mid-turn when you get beat out of a spot (or planned poorly) and you have to change your plans.

Also of note, you rarely want to use your valuable action to make a route adjustment....
 
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Stuart Platt
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Right - let me clarify then.

Move & Action PHASE has 4 CYCLES

On each CYCLE a player has a TURN

A TURN consists of:

a)Check Diamonds
b)Movement - Flight & Load / Unload

So on the Flight and Load portion of my Movement turn I can:

Orient my ship before movement
Move a number of hexes equal to my movement card (no sharp turns)
Load / Unload

-------------------

Why would I ever need to make sharp turns? I can orient then move each move TURN i.e before each card is resolved.
 
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Stuart Platt
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The more I read it, I think the following text in the rulebook is the problem:

Note: It never matters which way your Airship is pointing when your turn begins; you may swivel it however you like before you actually move it. Each turn’s flight (and its concerns regarding sharp turns) is considered separate from the previous turn’s flight.

I can only assume that you can adjust orientation at the start of the 1st cycle and have to keep pointing in the same direction between resolving move cards.
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Bigshowfan wrote:

I can only assume that you can adjust orientation at the start of the 1st cycle and have to keep pointing in the same direction between resolving move cards.


    That's my recollection of how I played as well. I responded earlier then deleted it because everyone else went down a different track.

             S.
 
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Mrs Smith
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Bigshowfan wrote:
Why would I ever need to make sharp turns? I can orient then move each move TURN i.e before each card is resolved.


On a turn where you flip over a 'Move 4' card, and the factory you were planning to go to 4 spaces away has already been emptied by someone and there's another factory 3 spaces away that you'd now rather go to. In that scenario you'd like to do a sharp turn.

We've always played that the direction your airship is facing is of no consequence to your movement, at any time.
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Stuart Platt
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Tegs wrote:
Bigshowfan wrote:
Why would I ever need to make sharp turns? I can orient then move each move TURN i.e before each card is resolved.


On a turn where you flip over a 'Move 4' card, and the factory you were planning to go to 4 spaces away has already been emptied by someone and there's another factory 3 spaces away that you'd now rather go to. In that scenario you'd like to do a sharp turn.


Which presumes that you cannot change your facing prior to moving which is not what the rules say...

Would love a clarification on this...
 
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Scott Almes
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mfaulk80 wrote:
paschott wrote:
Because I might want to get to a place within my move that would require a sharp turn. I've had that come up a couple of times where I could have picked up or dropped off of only I could have doubled back just a bit with a sharp turn. Perhaps someone else took the goods you wanted so you have to make new plans and things are off from your original plan.

The free facing let's you change your starting direction but that's completely different than making a sharp turn while moving - something with which an airship would likely have trouble. Route adjustments are there to help the player out, especially if your plans just got thrown off so it's more the idea that you scrapped all other plans to get your airship into a better position. I think it works relatively well thematically, though I usually just accept it as the rules of the game.

What he said.

It comes up when you are planning and only have certain distance cards available (usually because you're planning to use them on prior movements). More often, however, it comes up mid-turn when you get beat out of a spot (or planned poorly) and you have to change your plans.

Also of note, you rarely want to use your valuable action to make a route adjustment....


Yup - what they said The "no sharp turn" forces a player to plan where they are going, and makes it trickier to recover if your plans fall apart. That's when you have to use your route adjustment. Without the restriction, you could play the highest card you have every time and not have to plan out where you are going.

I hope that helps you out, and I hope you're enjoying the game
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Stuart Platt
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Thanks for that.

At what point can you adjust your facing though?
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Mathue Faulkner
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Bigshowfan wrote:
Tegs wrote:
Bigshowfan wrote:
Why would I ever need to make sharp turns? I can orient then move each move TURN i.e before each card is resolved.


On a turn where you flip over a 'Move 4' card, and the factory you were planning to go to 4 spaces away has already been emptied by someone and there's another factory 3 spaces away that you'd now rather go to. In that scenario you'd like to do a sharp turn.


Which presumes that you cannot change your facing prior to moving which is not what the rules say...

Would love a clarification on this...

A better example would be if you have Move 3 card, but you get blocked and only want to Move 1. It can't be done without a sharp turn.

Or a Move 4 card when you only want to move 2, etc. etc.
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Peter Schott
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You adjust your facing before you start moving each turn. So you have a "3" card up - you pick which direction you want to face, then move 3 with slow turns allowed along the way. As noted in the example above, if you were aiming towards one factory that is now empty and there's a nearby factory only 2 away, you'd need to make a sharp turn to get there. Your initial plans were interrupted and the "route adjustment" would be the best way to get to that factory to pick up goods.
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Stuart Platt
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mfaulk80 wrote:
A better example would be if you have Move 3 card, but you get blocked and only want to Move 1. It can't be done without a sharp turn.

Or a Move 4 card when you only want to move 2, etc. etc.


Now THAT makes sense. Thanks!

Ok. I see. So orientation can be shifted each move, but the NUMBER of spaces is set by the card. Got it.
 
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Matt Smith
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The way I explain it to new players is as follows:

At the start of each card, your airship is on the ground. By pulling on the anchor ropes, you can turn the ship to face in any direction. Once you take off, you can only perform wide turns while in the air. Once you move the mandatory number of hexes listed on your card, your airship lands, allowing it to be reoriented again at the start of the next card.

Not only does this make sense thematically and mechanically, but it helps players understand when and why they can reorient their ship, versus when they can only perform wide turns.
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Mathue Faulkner
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Bigshowfan wrote:
mfaulk80 wrote:
A better example would be if you have Move 3 card, but you get blocked and only want to Move 1. It can't be done without a sharp turn.

Or a Move 4 card when you only want to move 2, etc. etc.


Now THAT makes sense. Thanks!

Ok. I see. So orientation can be shifted each move, but the NUMBER of spaces is set by the card. Got it.

I think it was confusing because a Move 3 card CAN be used to move 2 spaces with two broad turns. At first, I thought the 3/2 was a good example, but it actually doesn't illustrate the limitation since it can be worked around.
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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Quote:

I think it was confusing because a Move 3 card CAN be used to move 2 spaces with two broad turns. At first, I thought the 3/2 was a good example, but it actually doesn't illustrate the limitation since it can be worked around.


If you want to move 2 spaces in a straight line, a move 3 will do. If you want to make a 2 space move that normally requires a single turn, you can't reach it with a move 3.
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Neil Christiansen
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I have played few times, but some have been with the rule you can change facing at the start of each movement phase and some at start of each turn (due to misreading of the rules). Both are fun and I would consider the former more "basic" and forgiving and the latter more advance and unforgiving. Both were equally fun for me.
 
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Lane Taylor
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chris1nd wrote:
I have played few times, but some have been with the rule you can change facing at the start of each movement phase and some at start of each turn (due to misreading of the rules). Both are fun and I would consider the former more "basic" and forgiving and the latter more advance and unforgiving. Both were equally fun for me.

We actually played the first game in 'hard mode', and it worked out ok. I may house rule that with the new group once they've got a few games under their belts.
 
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Seth Jaffee
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Wylann wrote:
chris1nd wrote:
I have played few times, but some have been with the rule you can change facing at the start of each movement phase and some at start of each turn (due to misreading of the rules). Both are fun and I would consider the former more "basic" and forgiving and the latter more advance and unforgiving. Both were equally fun for me.

We actually played the first game in 'hard mode', and it worked out ok. I may house rule that with the new group once they've got a few games under their belts.

The game is not really designed to require maintaining facing from move to move, but if that is fun for you, then by all means!
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Lane Taylor
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I agree that it wasn't meant that way. Not a criticism. We misplayed the first game. I think the second game, with that corrected, everyone's score jumped a good 10-15 pts, minimum.

If I were to house rule it, I might say that the change of facing can only happen when you load/unload, just to challenge my players a bit (but my old group was much more hardcore).
 
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