Recommend
9 
 Thumb up
 Hide
14 Posts

Space Empires: 4X» Forums » General

Subject: Doomsday machines completely owned me. Am i doing this right? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Bryan McNamara
United States
Matthews
North Carolina
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Wow, Doomsday for certain. I got he first machine down to 5 hull from 9, but I just couldn't get shots on it. B9 attack, 3 defense meant my scouts could only hit on a one, other ships on a 2 or 3. Insane. Is that correct?I mean attack of 9 means it is going to hit, 90% of the time!!

I guess tomorrow I'll buy more tech and less ships. I thought a swarm would work, but I didn't plan ahead for the super high stats.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Niko
Canada
Calgary
Alberta
flag msg tools
[This space intentionally left blank]
badge
Microbadge: Casual wargamerMicrobadge: COIN fan Microbadge: Band of Brothers fanMicrobadge: Space Empires: 4X fanMicrobadge: Motörhead fan
Without knowing what map size and difficulty you are playing it's hard to know if you are "doing it right". It sounds like you played the large map on 'normal' or 'harder' difficulty, giving you a strength 6 DM on turn 8 or 7. Is that right?
Otherwise make sure you're reading the chart correctly, the first number is the econ phase after which it appears, the second number is it's strength as written in the chart on the previous page.
Overall though, DMs are beasts in combat! Even a dreadnought is easier to shoot down. But that's the point, isn't it?

Your plan sounds good. I have written some strategy advice below, but personally I enjoy finding strategies of my own. Not sure how you and others feel about it, so it's hidden.
Spoiler (click to reveal)
You want lots of CAs or even better BCs (with at least either atk 2 and def 1 or vice versa) against one that strong. That way your ships can also take one extra hit before being destroyed, meaning the DM can destroy at most 2 in the first round rather than 5. Since the DM will probably fire first (tactic is somewhat of a waste of money IMHO) this is important!
You have 8 rounds (or 9, see advise below), so getting the tech is not the problem. Build ships as late as possible to avoid paying maintenance too.

Also remember that you should have some deep space to let it come towards you. That is important for two reasons:
1. You get another economy phase to build ships or move existing ones into position. MS pipelines are your friend here since Move technology is pretty expensive.
2. You know where it's coming from. Ideally you can build a base at the first planet it will attack and make your stand there.

My last bit of advise would be to chose your battles wisely. Rather give up a planet than have ships destroyed in a pointless last stand. The "regain 2 HP when destroying a planet" ability should never trigger, since that means two of your hits were wasted.
7 
 Thumb up
0.02
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bryan McNamara
United States
Matthews
North Carolina
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Thanks for hiding the strategy! I am indeed going to work on it on my own. Yes, I played the large map on normal difficulty.

I stopped exploring deep space because Danger kept taking my scouts, and I decided not to pay for terraforming, so there wasn't any point to it. I'm not sure if I would do that differently.

Awesome scenario, and I'm glad it whipped me. This game is amazing face to face, and being able to really enjoy it solitaire is a coup. I haven't even punched the expansion yet either. What a deal!
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Willow Pearson
England
Leicester
flag msg tools
Never drop a crate!
Avatar
Microbadge: StatisticianMicrobadge: Genomics researchMicrobadge: Computer ProgrammerMicrobadge: I am writing my thesis (and I'm going crazy!)Microbadge: Sierra Madre Games fan
Been teaching my partner the DM rules recently, in doing so we found that having a muster point roughly central to your empire, with a base and shipyards (bases will fire before most DMs) is essential, and especially on the last DM to let it come to you so you have the base involved too.

As for fleets, we went for as many ships of the tactics letter above the next DM as we could afford whist allowing for 1-2 pieces of research a turn.

Usually make it by the skin of our teeth, but it's fun.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bryan McNamara
United States
Matthews
North Carolina
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
That's the great thing, random planets and random DM entry mean it is hard to bait the doomsday.

I think I'll try to tech attack and defense way up, see how that goes.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Roberto Sanchez
United States
flag msg tools
I am doing the Solitaire scenario Small map and I am trying to understand which Economic phase I would bring in DM. For example 7/1 is that the 7th economic phase meaning I have 21 turns before the DM comes in???? I understand the strength 1 means to use the chart and look at the row #1.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Guido Gloor
Switzerland
Ostermundigen
Bern
flag msg tools
The statement below is false.
badge
The statement above is correct.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
rjsanchez wrote:
For example 7/1 is that the 7th economic phase meaning I have 21 turns before the DM comes in????
Yes They're fairly tough like that still.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Roberto Sanchez
United States
flag msg tools
Thanks for the quick update.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Plaid Dragon
United States
Austin
Texas
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I have defeated this scenario on a large map with normal difficulty. See spoiler for my strategies:

Spoiler (click to reveal)
1) I used 3x miners to collect rocks/wrecks. Any more is overkill.

2) I do not build additional scouts. Scout all your home space first before going to deep space. Run the scouts until they're gone, then don't worry about scouting.

3) Do not bother with Terraforming/Barren planets. Your home area planets will be good enough. You don't have the time or resources to go after barrens.

4) Mass CA's are how you take out the DM's. You'll not want to build any until you have off/def techs both at 2. Ideally 100% of your economy should be building CA's two (preferably three) turns before the first DM hits space. Don't build any DD's or scouts for the fight given you want to maximize your L2 combat techs.

5) Do not get movement techs (or any other techs aside from #8 below) given you're letting the DM come to you. MSP's will help you move if you decide not to face the baddies at your capital. You probably have time for a small network of MSP's to your closest colony planets.

6) The econ turn before the DM hits, slap down a base at the planet where you're making your stand given it's a good value.

7) Don't fight the DM in just to inflict a few hits. When you engage him it's to the death.

8) Your home shipyard should be brought to a count of 6. You'll want to fit in one level of shipyard tech. It's optional whether to build shipyards at other locales but you probably don't have much excess to spend in this regard.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Niko
Canada
Calgary
Alberta
flag msg tools
[This space intentionally left blank]
badge
Microbadge: Casual wargamerMicrobadge: COIN fan Microbadge: Band of Brothers fanMicrobadge: Space Empires: 4X fanMicrobadge: Motörhead fan
Generally very good advice, Plaid Dragon. Of course you need to adapt to the situation (if there are lots of NPA planets you might want to invest in terraforming, etc.)

Also, as mentioned above I think people appreciate it if any strategy advice is hidden by spoiler tags.
Figuring out the strategy is what makes this scenario interesting, but sometimes you just can't keep your eyes away from something you know you don't really want to read
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
You can't handle the truth?
Canada
Edmonton
Alberta
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Plaid_Dragon wrote:
1) I used 3x miners to collect rocks/wrecks. Any more is overkill.
Wait, am I missing something, I thought each color only had 2 miners?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Plaid Dragon
United States
Austin
Texas
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
CE expansion added more. Is there a rule on the limit you can field that I missed???

Sorry about not doing the spoiler thing. Didn't occur to me at the time but fixed it now.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
You can't handle the truth?
Canada
Edmonton
Alberta
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Plaid_Dragon wrote:
CE expansion added more. Is there a rule on the limit you can field that I missed???

Sorry about not doing the spoiler thing. Didn't occur to me at the time but fixed it now.
Nearest rule I have is:

7.5.4 Purchase Limits: If all Group counters of a particular ship type are already in play, you may not build new ships of that type (unless you scuttle ships in one of the groups in order to reuse the Group counter for the newly purchased ships).

Now, this does refer to group counters, so I am inferring that it also applies to ships that are not represented by group counters (Colony Ships, MS Pipeline, Miner)

(As for not using spoiler tags, the thread is all about how do defeat the Doomsday machines, strategy is expected, don't worry)
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bryan McNamara
United States
Matthews
North Carolina
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Spoiler tags are definitely appreciated. The first response to my opening post used them, and you will see that I thanked that person for using them. I only glanced over your post to avoid getting too many hints. I do appreciate that you contributed your strategy!
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls